1. 

   smallj53
   Member

   Hello,

   This is a test of your ability to tolerate a completely different viewpoint. Do not adjust your set. We will be with you shortly. *interference* *cue new channel*

   Ahem. Yes well, I can hardly believe (no pun intended) that I am posting here. As a convinced Roman Catholic elementary teacher who actively seeks to recruit children to become Roman Catholics because I sincerely believe that Roman Catholicism is the truth about reality, (whew that was a lot to write...) I clearly do not belong here. So delete away...

   Still here? Oh well, along now we shall go to the "Brave New Persecution" which I did put in this thread's heading.

   Given that I believe that physical reality and spiritual reality come from the same origin, it is quite easy to use examples from physical reality to illustrate what will happen in the area of human belief. We have earthquakes along tectonic plates, so we will have their equivalent along friction lines in belief systems.

   Persecution and all that goes with it is inevitable given how this new atheism is unfolding and progressing. And people like myself, with mortgages and children of my own, hopes and dreams, will be its victims.

   Curious. You think you are fighting some uphill battle against entrenched religious powers of great strength. Hardly. Western Civilization is now almost completely geared to atheism. Study history and how life was lived even just 100 or 200 years ago. Religion was everywhere. Today you have to look for it to find it. Here in Canada, most churches look like senior citizen's gatherings.

   So in closing, Atheism has already carried the day, you are just engaging in mopping up operations. When your state imposed atheism has finally taken away even a parent's right to raise their children as they see fit, people like myself will be quietly working away to undermine everything you believe in.

   We will see a return of the Roman Catholic Church in splendor and power beyond what can be presently conceived. Not in a generation or even two, but in ten or twenty. Count on it.

   Posted 8 months ago #
2. 

   richardcollins
   Administrator

   Be assured we are open to differing points of view so we thank you for contributing to the discussion. I am an atheist and would be pleased to live in a world without superstitious beliefs, however, I am not in favor of persecuting anyone. Our point of view is that the forced indoctrination of children violates their rights to an open future and self determination. Historically, institutions have brought children into their groups as a way of insuring the continuation of a certain set of beliefs. Our position is that if an institutions theology cannot gain and keep adults then that institution has failed and deserves to die off.

   I hardly think the USA has imposed atheism on the masses. Parents have rights, that is certainly true, but no set of rights is absolute and their rights are in conflict with the rights of children to grow up as autonomous people able to direct their lives as they see fit. In every other aspect of our lives we accept the doctrine that decisions belong to those who are most effected by them. That puts parents and religious institutions two steps removed. They should not be the controlling parties. Instead the parents role should be one of guarding the rights of their children and teaching them to think critically so they can make wise choices. Children need to understand the role religion plays in the lives of so many people, but this does not mean they need to choose a religion before they are mature enough to understand all the ramifications.

   
   

   Posted 7 months ago #
3. 

   smallj53
   Member

   This has been interesting. But I'll have another go at proving why persecution is inevitable and what the consequences will be.

   First of all, if you read 20th century history, Atheism is a central theme. Surprised? I hope not. The overturning of religion and the persecution of believers around the globe hardly needs to be proved. In country after country communistic atheism has afflicted religious communities, jailed religious leaders,
   enacted laws that deny jobs to believers and acted in ways are clearly consistent with the belief that religion is a delusion and as you put it, a superstition.

   In the opening chapter of the book, Mao: The Unknown Story written by Jung Chang and Jon Halliday, the following is found written:

   Mao Tse-Tung, who for decades held absolute power over the lives of one-quarter of the world's population, was responsible for well over 70 million deaths in peacetime, more than any other twentieth-century leader.

   The rest of the book is a litany of atrocity and unspeakable crime. Words cannot convey the horror of reading what happened in China, at the hands of supposedly sane and unsuperstitious atheistic leaders.

   And we haven't even begun to talk about Stalin or Pol Pot.

   So, thanks for welcoming me to the forum. I look forward to your next post.

   Posted 7 months ago #
4. 

   richardcollins
   Administrator

   You write:
   proving why persecution is inevitable and what the consequences will be
   ++++

   You cite several dictatorial regimes and try to link the fact that they are dictatorial to the fact the dictators were atheists. The atrocities committed by Stalin, Hitler, Pol Pot and Mao, did not happen because they were atheists. They happened because religion was a rival for power as it has always been. That I agree is inevitable. In the case of China, Cambodia and Russia all these countries were poverty stricken with high rates of illiteracy. Peasants in these countries had no notion of human rights.

   How does your theory of atheism as automatically leading to persecution of religion mesh with the fact that Europe is now commonly referred to as post-Christian Europe? I don't recall reading about a violent suppression there in the recent history. It would seem the minority religious population in Europe, Canada, New Zealand, Japan and even parts of the US are not suffering badly. In fact these regions enjoy the highest quality of life.

   You need to work some more on your theory. Plus, the past is not always prologue. Thankfully we do learn from our mistakes. The Christian as persecuted minority is an old trope.

   
   

   Posted 6 months ago #

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